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5:30-7:30 min mark

Don’t take out of context what I said, I generally take care of my things especially things I value.

Like my time, The time I traded for currency to afford the patriot. The time I may or may not choose to clean or not to clean.

I could have bought a much cheaper rifle and much cheaper powder. And been shooting months ago. However I may want to throw one shot down range and not have to worry about cleaning down my rifle .( I live on my range)

That’s why I spent the extra coin on the patriot and am willing to wait and purchase Blackhorn is because when a manufacturer recommends something about a high end product they offer I generally start there as a baseline.

in the expectations that there product lives up to their claims.

If it doesn’t I adapt.
 

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billyboy* said:
All Good Advice
You might want purchase some VV N110. A LOT LESS RECOIL than BH 209 in the Lightweight Patriot 🫏!
Try starting with 30 Grs VV N110 with a Knurled inexpensive Hornady 200 Gr XTP in a Light Blue Smooth Harvester Sabot for Plinking & Small Game.
Then maybe switch to The 225 Gr Fury or the All Copper 195 Gr Barnes Expander for Big Game 💥!
ENJOY that Patriot 👍
Click to expand...
The “A LOT LESS RECOIL “ and the fact that woodman has recommended load data on there site for Vihtavuori N120 with the patriot.
https://www.woodmanarms.com/load-data.php

Has me sincerely trying to find some if I continue to have issues finding. Blackhorn what would be the best cleaning solution and or process after use with such powder?

I’ll run some searches just looking to see what you guys recommend.

Not a lot of muzzleloading enthusiasts or gun shops locally so I’ll likely have to order what ever I’m using so I’d like to put a proper order together when I do as to make best use of the hazmat charge. I found it one place so far. Any suggestions there would be greatly appreciated as well.

Also I guess I’d have to buy a powder scale as well. Recommendations on a budget friendly reliable one would also be appreciated.

Thanks again.
 
Samoset said:
Thanks,

I guess the next question is there and huge benefit to one over the other. In this application?
Click to expand...
I use Both Powders in Various Muzzleloaders.
Less Recoil, More Economical & Faster Obturation with the VV N110 as you are Burning 30+ Grains.
VV N120 you are Burning 50+ Grains.

Just Think About the Recoil Difference Between using 100 Grs V (70 +/_ Wt) BH 209 vs 30 Grs Wt VV N110 in Powder

And it appears you are in North Carolina so WHY NOT USE SMOKELESS
 
So moving forward into potentially working Up a smokeless load for my patriot , I have a few more questions,

Is a scale of this nature adequate for measuring smokeless powder

Scale

This was essentially the cleaning procedure I had intended of following for Blackhorn would this be adequate for smokeless as well.

Cleaning process

and finally are cheddite 209 primers suitable for use with Blackhorn and smokeless powders ?


Thanks in advance for any advice.
 
Samoset said:
So moving forward into potentially working Up a smokeless load for my patriot , I have a few more questions,

Is a scale of this nature adequate for measuring smokeless powder

Scale

This was essentially the cleaning procedure I had intended of following for Blackhorn would this be adequate for smokeless as well.

Cleaning process

and finally are cheddite 209 primers suitable for use with Blackhorn and smokeless powders ?


Thanks in advance for any advice.
Click to expand...

That Scale will work Fine.

The Cleaning Procedure with BH 209 & Smokeless would be generally the same as Centerfire Rifle. Lots of Opinions on this.
I like KG 1 for the Carbon Fouling with both BH 209 & Smokeless.

Do you have the High Pressure Adjustable Bushing Breech Plug? If Not, I would Highly recommend it. Those Cheddites Primers should work Fine, they are a little Shorter than most so the Adjustable Breech is Nice. Woodman Arms recommends the Remington STS. I like the Federal 209A as they are the Hottest. Lots of Opinions on this.

I would suggest Posting in the Inline Section or the Smokeless Section to get More Responses. Feel free to send me a PM.
 
billyboy* said:
Beautiful & the Recoil of a .243 Winchester 👏!
Click to expand...
Probably not even that!
Ninering62 said:
Nice light load, pleasant to shoot & damn nice shooting. Those "weak link" sabots are just terrible aren't they.
Click to expand...
Yep, send all your HLBS to me! Those 3 shots were fired back to back to back, no waiting. After the last shot, the barrel, maybe had the slightest feel of a faint hint of being warm.
 
billyboy* said:
That Scale will work Fine.

The Cleaning Procedure with BH 209 & Smokeless would be generally the same as Centerfire Rifle. Lots of Opinions on this.
I like KG 1 for the Carbon Fouling with both BH 209 & Smokeless.

Do you have the High Pressure Adjustable Bushing Breech Plug? If Not, I would Highly recommend it. Those Cheddites Primers should work Fine, they are a little Shorter than most so the Adjustable Breech is Nice. Woodman Arms recommends the Remington STS. I like the Federal 209A as they are the Hottest. Lots of Opinions on this.

I would suggest Posting in the Inline Section or the Smokeless Section to get More Responses. Feel free to send me a PM.
Click to expand...
If a mod would like to move this thread it would not bother me whatsoever, I’m a firm believer in not creating unnecessary thread content on forums.

I didn’t realize grafs had a 4# minimum, the cheddits are available on their site as well . Split the hazmat and shipping across the lot.

There is still potentially a lot of powder there I might not like.

Add in a scale and an adjustable high pressure breech and I’m back to thinking I should just keep looking for quality primers locally and wait till some Blackhorn is available.

I have no idea the shelf life on those powders or if they will meet my likings or needs .

So I think even though I’m entertaining the ideas. I may just play it patient for a moment.
 
Samoset said:
There is still potentially a lot of powder there I might not like.
Click to expand...
ZERO CHANCE you Won't Like VV N110
Samoset said:
Add in a scale and an adjustable high pressure breech and I’m back to thinking I should just keep looking for quality primers locally and wait till some Blackhorn is available.
Click to expand...
High Pressure Adjustable Breech Plug is Recommended for BH 209 or Smokeless to Eliminate Blow By / Primer Leakage
Samoset said:
I have no idea the shelf life on those powders or if they will meet my likings or needs .
Click to expand...
That shouldn't be a Concern with VV N110. I have Powders that are Over 30 Years Old
Samoset said:
So I think even though I’m entertaining the ideas. I may just play it patient for a moment.
Click to expand...
We All have Choices but BH 209 at $80 for 8 Ounces, SERIOUS EXTRA CLEANING & MULE KICKING RECOIL Hmmmmmmm?
 
billyboy* said:
ZERO CHANCE you Won't Like VV N110

High Pressure Adjustable Breech Plug is Recommended for BH 209 or Smokeless to Eliminate Blow By / Primer Leakage

That shouldn't be a Concern with VV N110. I have Powders that are Over 30 Years Old

We All have Choices but BH 209 at $80 for 8 Ounces, SERIOUS EXTRA CLEANING & MULE KICKING RECOIL Hmmmmmmm?
Click to expand...
Well this isn’t a rabbit hole I was planning on going down but I have plenty of shovels and back left in my age.
 
billyboy* said:
ZERO CHANCE you Won't Like VV N110

High Pressure Adjustable Breech Plug is Recommended for BH 209 or Smokeless to Eliminate Blow By / Primer Leakage

That shouldn't be a Concern with VV N110. I have Powders that are Over 30 Years Old

We All have Choices but BH 209 at $80 for 8 Ounces, SERIOUS EXTRA CLEANING & MULE KICKING RECOIL Hmmmmmmm?
Click to expand...
billyboy is spot on here !
 
billyboy* said:
ZERO CHANCE you Won't Like VV N110

High Pressure Adjustable Breech Plug is Recommended for BH 209 or Smokeless to Eliminate Blow By / Primer Leakage

That shouldn't be a Concern with VV N110. I have Powders that are Over 30 Years Old

We All have Choices but BH 209 at $80 for 8 Ounces, SERIOUS EXTRA CLEANING & MULE KICKING RECOIL Hmmmmmmm?
Click to expand...
I got 2 or 3 bottles of BH209 I wish I could trade for N110.
 
I want to Apologize for Pushing Smokeless Powder & especially the VV N110. Smokeless is Not for Everyone. I Forget sometimes that some people Don't Reload for Centerfire Cartridges. I knew a Smokeless Muzzleloader Builder that wouldn't Sell to someone that didn't Reload Centerfire Cartridges. There is a Reason that Woodman Arms Doesn't List N110 in their Manual because it is Faster Burning & Requires a lot less Quantity. Savage Arms did this with their "Book Loads" for their .50 Cal 10ML-II. They Wanted Powders that used approximately the Same 40 Grs +/-. If you aren't Comfortable & Don't have someone experienced Locally to Guide you Please either recruit them or stick to Blackpower Subs. NO DISTRACTIONS during the Reloading Process & WITNESS MARKS on All Ramrods. SAFETY FIRST ⚠️💥🚑
 

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