Are all balls created equal???

[CoHiCntry]

OK... so I've been looking online to buy some .54 caliber balls.  I see what looks like the most common size of .530... I also see some .535 & even .520 all listed under .54 caliber.  Should I be buying the .530 to start with?  Why, or when would someone get the other sizes?

Also for patches... looks like the size is 0.10.  There are other sizes but to start with am I correct in thinking a .530 ball + a 0.10 patch = .54.  Anything I'm missing here?

Anyone wanna shed some light on the different patch materials that are available and there pros & cons?  I see some regular cotton patches then pillow ticking and a couple others.  What's the difference?

 

[Smokin' Joe]

I would recommend .530 round balls and a .015 patch.  The different sizes are because not every barrel is created equal. The .010 are too thin for my liking.

The last order for patches (which has been awhile) I ordered "non-lubed". I then melted down some Frontiers Patch lube in the microwave, coated the patches, stacked them up, placed them in a zip lock baggie then squeezed then in a vice to wring them out a bit.  I think that's how Daniel Boone did it. 

I forgot to mention when I was lubing the patches: I dipped every other one.  When I stacked them there would be a wet patch then a dry patch, wet one dry one and so on.  When I squeezed them in the vice all the dry patched absorbed the lubed from the wet patches and all patches were lubed equally.

 

[Buck Conner1]

Do as Joe recommended and you'll have a good starting point with .530, later once the gun has been broke in you may want to try a larger diameter to see if that helps or hurts how it shoots. Seems some barrels perform better with what they like?  :Questuon:

 

[exMember]

What rifle you shooting?

 

[CoHiCntry]

What rifle you shooting?

I recently had a .54 caliber GRRW built.  Kit Carson Hawken, percussion.  It has a 1:56" twist barrel.

 

[exMember]

Ok, I would agree, go with at least a .015 patch. I used both .018 and .020 patches in the GRRW Hawken that Buck sent me. The .020's were tight, but that was a brand new barrel. I'd shoot for the .015" patches to start off with.

 

[Buck Conner1]

Have used custom muzzleloaders since 1980, Large, Douglas or Rice barrels are the general run with Long's Locks, various woods. 

CoHiCntry your rifle we built you is a GRRW Collectors Association gun built by Carl Walker out of Rossevelt, UT (first employee of GRRW).  Nice man to deal with and has become friends with the new clients of GRRW.CA (just like the old days at the old firm).

 

[CoHiCntry]

 

[exMember]

That's an ugly rifle. You should send it to me and have a good looking one built.


:twisted:

 

[CoHiCntry]

That's an ugly rifle. You should send it to me and have a good looking one built.


:twisted:

LOL!!!

 

[exMember]

Maple always amazes me. Thin stripes, horizontal stripes,lightNing striping, just amazing what shapes maple can come in.

 

[CoHiCntry]

Thanks everyone for your input!  I put in an order at TOTW today for some balls and a couple different sized patches.  I'll try these out and go from there...  Definitely learned a little through this thread.

 

[Coalforge1]

When these companies offered "swagged" round balls is when I got interested. Cast round balls if not weighted can become an issue with small voids not visible to the eye when casted (mold to hot or cold causes this). Swagged on the other hand are made with pressure not having the voids (air pockets) that can make a flyer or not shoot the same as the previous shot.

Buck made the above comment.   After I bought DUTCH"S program, I started weighing balls. I found far more variation in the swagged balls than I did in the cast balls. I don't know why. If someone has the ability, weigh 20 of each and let me know the results.

 

[Hylander]

I want that Rifle !

 

[Buck Conner1]

Contact me at: [email protected]  and I can help you get what you want.  Buck

 

[Renegadehunter]

To put it simply, swaged RBs are formed in a die that has a bleed hole.  To ensure it forms completely there is an excessive amount of lead that enters the die than what is necessary to get a 230 grain RB (for example).  Once the RB completely forms, the excess is extruded out the bleed hole.  If you look closely at a swaged RB you will see a tiny spot on it where the excess lead was forced out of it and through the bleed hole.  The variation is more from how big of a range the manufacturer decides is ok for the target weight.  For example, they may have a spec of 230 grains, plus/minus 2 whole grains.  Say the machine gets set up and is running at an average of 231 grains, well within their spec.  Then the machine has some sort of issue like the die breaking or something, and it could even be a different person on a different shift when something like this happens.  They repair the machine and then check a few and find that the RB's now weigh an average 229 grains.  Still well within their spec, so the machine is ran that way.  Manufacturers use "Lot" sizes, so the above could happen and you have half a "Lot" that averages 231 grains and the other half 229 grains...plus whatever normal deviation is present in the machine. 
Lot sizes are much bigger than the 100 round boxes we buy, so you are going to get some good ones that are all very close in weight to each other because the machine ran the whole time without any issues or adjustments...but then you'll also possibly get some that did have an issue and changes or adjustments were made.

So either weighing and sorting the store bought ones, or casting your own using tight tolerances is going to be the best method to ensure they are as close to each other as possible if you are looking for 10x accuracy.

 

[Mofish]

Sizes can make a difference in performance

 

[Buck Conner1]

Mofish your the guy  :cheers:      :lol!:

 

[Smokin' Joe]

I weighed 20 Hornady .530 swagged balls.  I didn't have any hand cast to weigh.  I also weighed 20 Hornady .570 swagged balls and 20 .570 "Hand Cast". All round balls from TOTW.  I found the "hand cast" were more consistent, however they were 5 gn lighter. 

Results:

54 cal .530 swagged   = high 227.4 gn,  low 223.5 gn,  average 225.76
58 cal .570 swagged   = high 280.9 gn,  low 277.6 gn,  average 279.145
58 cal .570 hand cast = high 275.2 gn,  low 273.2 gn,   average 274.395

 

[Buck Conner1]

Good Information

Thanks Joe, that's valuable information to keep.  I glad we have guys like you that are willing to put out the effort to check these subjects and provide a clear answers.  Thanks again bud.  :ttups: