Help** CVA Accura v2

[SSAUCENM17]

Hello guys.. I’m no newbie to muzzleloading but this one has got me stumped! (The rifle was given to me as a tip from a hunter. And I love everything about it!) it’s the muzzleloader with the konus scope package I sight it in 3-4” high at 100yd at 200 it’s dead nuts off a sled. At 300 about 8-10 feet low!! The hold is well below the post with it all the way zoomed in on 10x?! Can anyone give me an insight? I’ve tested with 150gr. Of pyrodex pellets and also 150gr of white hot. 245gr are aerolite powerbelt. Excuse my sweet artistic skills. TIA

 

[michiganmuzzy]

Wow! 8-10 feet is quite a lot of drop. First i would switch to powder instead of pellets. BH209 or T7. Shoot some hot loads and see what happens. Then i would switch to something more aerodynamic like barnes TMZ or Hornady SSTs 200-250grains. Maybe even the ELRs. See what that gets you

 

[SSAUCENM17]

Wow! 8-10 feet is quite a lot of drop. First i would switch to powder instead of pellets. BH209 or T7. Shoot some hot loads and see what happens. Then i would switch to something more aerodynamic like barnes TMZ or Hornady SSTs 200-250grains. Maybe even the ELRs. See what that gets you

I agree! It basically just falls off the planet! I’m mind-blown, I’m going to switch to the bighorn after this season. My NM mule deer hunts in exactly 1 week! :/ I was thinking I may not be getting full ignition but I really don’t know...?

 

[dbowling]

Powerbelts are one of your problems. If your pellets are old or have drawn moisture then they are pretty much junk. But doesnt make sense how you can be dead on at 200 and 8-10ft low at 300, your bullet has to basically be dropping 10-12 inches ever 10 yd which is pretty much impossible or seems it should be.

 

[SSAUCENM17]

Powerbelts are one of your problems. If your pellets are old or have drawn moisture then they are pretty much junk. But doesnt make sense how you can be dead on at 200 and 8-10ft low at 300, your bullet has to basically be dropping 10-12 inches ever 10 yd which is pretty much impossible or seems it should be.

I’m not making this up buddy... that’s exactly what I said! It seems unreal. Like the trajectory doesn’t add up to me

 

[GM54-120]

There is no 245gr 50cal Aerolite. There is a 250gr and the BC is horrible. There is a 245gr AeroTip and the BC is even worse than the AeroLite. Even a 150gr load will shed velocity like crazy. I cant imagine using something like that for any kind of long range work and at close range that Powebelt is gunna come apart like a varmint bullet.

A claimed BC of .161 is just terrible.
https://www.bpioutdoors.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/Ballistics.pdf

 

[shiner200gr]

I think you have more than one problem here. I would start with a bullet that flies well. The Remington 250 Expander is the best I have found in that category, and I have actually spent a bunch of time and money coming to that conclusion. As GM54-120 says, lose the Powerbelt in any event. Triple 7 is the real deal, and KONUS....seriously??

 

[Lonehand]

Well regardless of how crappy the BC, it is mathematically impossible to be 4 inches high at 100. Dead-on at 200 and 8 feet low at 300. If this happened in consecutive shots one at 100 then one at 200 then one at 300 with no adjustments we need to call out the college physics department. If you did not do the above scenario (consecutive shots at each distance), but were adjusting scope between the distances and not revisiting the previous distances, I have a possible reason for your results. On some scopes, the adjustments you make on the dial need to be moved by the recoil of the rifle and may need a few shots to move the full distance. Example You were shooting high at 200. Dial it down, But the reticle needs a bump to move. You shoot again, so on the second shot you are still high you dial down again. By the third or fourth shot, you are zeroed on paper, but your sticky reticle still has a way to go. You finally are ready for 300. Start shooting and it goes lower and lower until the reticle finally seats. I had a VX1 that caused me fits until I realized it needed a "bump" to move. If after you were 8 feet low you went back to 200 and shot was dead on. My theory is garbage. Call the professors.

 

[USN2TN]

Disclaimer: I'm not an expert on muzzleloaders; I'm more of a lifetime rifle guy. The only reason I'm saying anything is that I'm relatively new to muzzleloaders and I have a very similar rig as yours.
I used the forum search tools on here and listened to smarter people than me - experience counts. Now I run 96gr BH209 by volume under TMZ's with Harvester Sabots. If I do my job off a solid rest, it now shoots bug-holes at 100 yds and clean-up is a TON easier. Once I throw in the shooting sticks and my 55yr old shoulder it does open up some but it still holds minute of deer. If I decide to stretch out past 150 yds I will need more gas in the tank but that's for after deer season is over. Best of luck.

 

[SSAUCENM17]

There is no 245gr 50cal Aerolite. There is a 250gr and the BC is horrible. There is a 245gr AeroTip and the BC is even worse than the AeroLite. Even a 150gr load will shed velocity like crazy. I cant imagine using something like that for any kind of long range work and at close range that Powebelt is gunna come apart like a varmint bullet.

A claimed BC of .161 is just terrible.
https://www.bpioutdoors.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/Ballistics.pdf

You’re correct it’s an Aerotip. Thanks for the info! And yes I have noticed the bullet to frag out on multiple occasions.

 

[SSAUCENM17]

Well regardless of how crappy the BC, it is mathematically impossible to be 4 inches high at 100. Dead-on at 200 and 8 feet low at 300. If this happened in consecutive shots one at 100 then one at 200 then one at 300 with no adjustments we need to call out the college physics department. If you did not do the above scenario (consecutive shots at each distance), but were adjusting scope between the distances and not revisiting the previous distances, I have a possible reason for your results. On some scopes, the adjustments you make on the dial need to be moved by the recoil of the rifle and may need a few shots to move the full distance. Example You were shooting high at 200. Dial it down, But the reticle needs a bump to move. You shoot again, so on the second shot you are still high you dial down again. By the third or fourth shot, you are zeroed on paper, but your sticky reticle still has a way to go. You finally are ready for 300. Start shooting and it goes lower and lower until the reticle finally seats. I had a VX1 that caused me fits until I realized it needed a "bump" to move. If after you were 8 feet low you went back to 200 and shot was dead on. My theory is garbage. Call the professors.

I shot 100, 200, then 300. But never went back down. Kinda silly but I don’t know why but it never dawned on me to shoot back at the 200yd as for moving and bumping the scope I never did even turn a dial.

 

[SSAUCENM17]

Disclaimer: I'm not an expert on muzzleloaders; I'm more of a lifetime rifle guy. The only reason I'm saying anything is that I'm relatively new to muzzleloaders and I have a very similar rig as yours.
I used the forum search tools on here and listened to smarter people than me - experience counts. Now I run 96gr BH209 by volume under TMZ's with Harvester Sabots. If I do my job off a solid rest, it now shoots bug-holes at 100 yds and clean-up is a TON easier. Once I throw in the shooting sticks and my 55yr old shoulder it does open up some but it still holds minute of deer. If I decide to stretch out past 150 yds I will need more gas in the tank but that's for after deer season is over. Best of luck.

I really do plan on going with the BH209 thanks buddy

 

[GM54-120]

What happens to a stabilized bullet when it goes transonic? Because that will be what is happening before that PB bullet reaches 300 yards.

 

[SSAUCENM17]

What happens to a stabilized bullet when it goes transonic? Because that will be what is happening before that PB bullet reaches 300 yards.

Can you elaborate a little on this for me? I like where you’re going with this just need to make certain I’m picking up what you’re throwing down.

 

[Pathfinder60]

Can you elaborate a little on this for me? I like where you’re going with this just need to make certain I’m picking up what you’re throwing down.

What he's saying is he's wondering if the bullet is destabilizing after it slows to subsonic levels... below 1123 fps that is. On your 300 yard shots, did the bullet keyhole at all? I'm with others here that believe it's not physically possible for a bullet to drop that far that fast without something pulling the chute on it. And I'd ditch those bullets too if I were you. Someone else mentioned the 250gr Remington Expander and I completely agree. In my Plains Rifle they are they best I've found after trying nearly a dozen different bullets. 100 grains by volume of BH209 and those Remington bullets are sub MOA out to 200 yrs. I have yet to try beyond because I don't have the room where I shoot.

 

[ronlaughlin]

What he's saying is he's wondering if the bullet is destabilizing after it slows to subsonic levels... below 1123 fps that is......

Maybe not.

Perhaps the bullet is enduring "buffeting" when it drops through the speed of sound. Perhaps this "buffeting" whilst going transonic is affecting the bullet flight; pushing it off aim.

It would seem there is quite a disturbance of air to create the sonic boom at the speed of sound.

 

[GM54-120]

Maybe not.

Perhaps the bullet is enduring "buffeting" when it drops through the speed of sound. Perhaps this "buffeting" whilst going transonic is affecting the bullet flight; pushing it off aim.

It would seem there is quite a disturbance of air to create the sonic boom at the speed of sound.

This^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

When a bullet goes transonic things happen such as yaw. That yaw creates way more drag on the bullet, especially something like a VERY light for caliber Powerbelt 50 245gr. That bullet is dinky by 50cal standards, even 50cal pistol calibers.

 

[shiner200gr]

Lets face it....the thing is an aerodynamic brick that probably wasn't stable when it left the barrel to begin with.

 

[shiner200gr]

And by the way, I just recalled an experience I had with my own Accura V2 that wasn't the rifle's fault OR the bullet's fault.
I had a Nikon BDC 300 muzzleloader scope on it and had the same problem as described here. After a range session with these weird results I went home and re-read the scope instructions. The BDC reticle ONLY worked at extended ranges IF the scope was set at maximum magnification (in this case it was 9X). I looked at m scope and it was set at 4X. The instructions tell you that the center crosshair intersection is always on, no matter the magnification setting, but beyond that, it must be at max for the yardage graduations to be true. Betting that's the problem.

 

[snapbang]

On some scopes, the adjustments you make on the dial need to be moved by the recoil of the rifle and may need a few shots to move the full distance. Example You were shooting high at 200. Dial it down, But the reticle needs a bump to move. You shoot again, so on the second shot you are still high you dial down again. By the third or fourth shot, you are zeroed on paper, but your sticky reticle still has a way to go. You finally are ready for 300. Start shooting and it goes lower and lower until the reticle finally seats. I had a VX1 that caused me fits until I realized it needed a "bump" to move.

On any scope I own and any adjustment I make, I vigorously tap the scope mounts with a light weight tool of some kind to get the reticle to seat before I continue shooting.