Huntsman, Hubbard 209 Breech Plug, Blackhorn 209 Range Repor

[Busta]

Got out this afternoon to shoot the Huntsman with the Hubbard 209 Breech plug and Blackhorn 209 powder. It worked flawlessly, perfect ignition everytime. I shot saboted bullets, White Power Punch Conicals, and the NEW Hornady FPB. I have been waiting for a plug like this for over 5 years, and I really like the results. All shots were with the Hubbard 209 breech plug today.

Group 1 (center bull, Pic #1) for the day was T/C 240 gr Cheapshots, 80 gr BH209, Win W209 Primers. The group was a vertical string and measured 1.255".

Pic #1

Group 2 (lower right bull, Pic #1) was Hornady 300 gr .452 XTP/MAG, 80 gr BH209, Red Harvester Crush Rib Sabots (for smokeless muzzleloaders), 80 gr BH209, Win W209 Primers. This group measured 1.901"

Group 3 (lower left bull, Pic #1 and Pic #2) was the NEW Hornady 350 gr FPB. To my surprise, this bullet loaded flawlessly, ignition was perfect, and accuracy was exceptional. This group measured .580", what a great shooting bullet. Look out PowerBelt, this bullet is for real.

Pic #2

Group 4 (upper left bull, Pic #1) was the Knight/Barnes 250 gr PBT with the NEW Blue EZ Load Sabots, 80 gr BH209, and Win W209 Primers. The group measured at 1.373". These sabots load WAY to easy in the .502 NEF Bore, but surprisingly I had instant ignition every time.

Group 5 (upper right bull, Pic #1) was the Hornady 300 gr SST, 80 gr BH209, CCI 209 Primers. The first two were touching, but pulled the third to the right making for a 1.340" horizontal group.


Since the Hornady FPB's worked so well I deceided to try out some all lead conicals. I pulled out some White 440 grain Power Punch Bullets, two .060" x .518" fiber gasket wads, 70 grains BH209, CCI Primers. All loads fired perfectly, absolutely no hang/delayed fires today and the best group of the day at .552". I truely was shocked at the results, the conicals outshot the saboted bullets, and I deceided to quit while I was ahead. Still grinnin'.

 

[Joes]

Great post Busta the huntsman and BH209 perfect together with new breach plug.

 

[frontier gander]

WOW! great shooting! How many yards was this?

I saw some of those 440 powerpunch conicals are the sportsmans warehouse.

 

[Busta]

Great post Busta the huntsman and BH209 perfect together with new breach plug.

Well, yesterday it was, but I've been shooting muzzleloaders long enough to know that tomorrow is a whole new day. :?

FG,

100 yards. That is our standard measurement around these parts, and the maximum I can shoot on my behind the barn range. If I go to the Gun Club, then it is 100 meters (approx. 110 yards) to 300 meters. At the farm, I have 1-1/4 miles if I need it. :lol: My bullet tests go through the torture chamber at 50 yards though. I want to know what they will do on a pissed off big old bull elk that you just called in close. Tested the Hornady FPB yesterday, not perfect but it passed. The built in skirt did prove to be it's savior, as I suspected it may. I'd say hornady did their homework on this bullet. It still would not be my first choice for elk, but it is far from the last.

I would have to go back and check my records, but IIRC they started at 351 grains and retained (L-R) 343 gr, 292 gr, 342 gr. That is an average of around 325 gr or 93% retention, I'll take that any day. Notice the stoutness of the skirt, giving it the structural integrity to stay together and retain weight.

 

[txhunter58]

Glad to hear the PRB's passed your torture test!

I just ordered 3 more boxes to see if they will shoot well out of my KRB as hollowpoints. That way, after I get my Colorado buck with them, I won't have to change to chase a cow. Or if a cow wanders in front of me when I am going after a timberline buck, that works too.

You did not use a wad under the PRB's did you? With their skirt, I figure they would be better without one?

By the way, can you still order powerpunch bullets or do you have to cast them yourselves?

 

[frontier gander]

Wow for 100 yards, the bullet really mushroomed a lot with 80 grains. Some chunks missing and some splits. How do they think they'd hold up with a stiffer 100 grain charge?

 

[Underclocked]

Busta, great shooting. Good to know the BH209 can be used with conicals - at least in some rifles. Have you mic'd the largest outer diameter of those Hornady PRBs?

Your Huntman's land-land is .502? What diameter are those PowerPunch you have?

 

[txhunter58]

Frontier, I don't think those bullets are the ones he shot at 100 yards. Pretty sure they are from his "torture test" at 50 yards with probably more powder than 80 grains. remember his powerbelt bullets from his torture test? They were deformed beyond what 80 grains at 100 yards would do.

Anyone have an opinion on whether it would be better to shoot the PRB's as hollowpoints or try and cut off the tip and leave the rest of the post in the bullet?

 

[lane]

Great post Busta the huntsman and BH209 perfect together with new breach plug.

Well, yesterday it was, but I've been shooting muzzleloaders long enough to know that tomorrow is a whole new day. :?

FG,

100 yards. That is our standard measurement around these parts, and the maximum I can shoot on my behind the barn range. If I go to the Gun Club, then it is 100 meters (approx. 110 yards) to 300 meters. At the farm, I have 1-1/4 miles if I need it. :lol: My bullet tests go through the torture chamber at 50 yards though. I want to know what they will do on a pissed off big old bull elk that you just called in close. Tested the Hornady FPB yesterday, not perfect but it passed. The built in skirt did prove to be it's savior, as I suspected it may. I'd say hornady did their homework on this bullet. It still would not be my first choice for elk, but it is far from the last.

I would have to go back and check my records, but IIRC they started at 351 grains and retained (L-R) 343 gr, 292 gr, 342 gr. That is an average of around 325 gr or 93% retention, I'll take that any day. Notice the stoutness of the skirt, giving it the structural integrity to stay together and retain weight.

What load were you pushing these at for the 50 yard test? What was the terminal media used?

.

 

[Busta]

Wow for 100 yards, the bullet really mushroomed a lot with 80 grains. Some chunks missing and some splits. How do they think they'd hold up with a stiffer 100 grain charge?

Those 3 are from 50 yards, I didn't recover any of the 100 yard bullets out of the backstop/berm. There are too many other bullets in that backstop to even try to recover them. The first one (middle) was the one that lost most of the weight, the second one (left) had a tear, the last one (right) looked real good. Next time I shoot, I'll shoot some in my trap at 100 to see how they do. I just wanted to know how these stack up to my other bullets. You don't need 100 grains of powder to kill an elk or any deer with a conical, I do it with 80 grains and a GOOD bullet.

 

[Busta]

Busta, great shooting. Good to know the BH209 can be used with conicals - at least in some rifles. Have you mic'd the largest outer diameter of those Hornady PRBs?

Your Huntman's land-land is .502? What diameter are those PowerPunch you have?

The Hornady FPB measuremens can be found in the FPB thread. IIRC it was .507" at the base of the flare, and .498" up off the base. The base swadges down to whatever your land to land measurement is, and works as advertised. Imagine that! Those bullets I shot into the trap had good rifling cut into them.

Yes, the Huntsman is .502" land to land. The 440 gr Power Punch measures .503".

 

[txhunter58]

So, were these bullets shot with 80 grains of209? And what backstop did you use?

 

[omegaman]

txhunter58, I trust you'll try the Hornady 350's with 80gr BH 209 from your KRB and report back? Also I'd cut the tip flush....

 

[Busta]

What load were you pushing these at for the 50 yard test? What was the terminal media used?

.

It was 80 grains of BH209. The media is a white silica sand in a heavy plastic bag that will fragment lesser bullets. Not very scientific, but is a standard test for any bullet I will consider for an elk hunt. PowerBelts, Hornady Great Plains, and Buffalo Bullets all fail MY test. Your mileage may vary.

 

[txhunter58]

I doubt I will try 209 with my KRB, since those that have says it won't combust reliably in this gun. I hope that Knight will come up with a breech plug that will work with it in the next year.

Those guys in the R & D dept must be pulling their hair out. The Omega has a "crud ring" problem, so Knight comes up with a breech plug that eliminated that problem, then they come out with 209 which won't work with this new and improved breech plug!

However, I will try it with my Omega. Since my omega will shoot powerbelts ok (although not any other conical), maybe it will shoot the PRB's due to their similar rear end design. I have only seen one thread where someone tried 209 and the prbs with an Omega, and it didn't work too well, but I will just have to try it out of my gun.

 

[Grouse]

Very nice shooting. Thanks for the update on connicals as well.

 

[wayles]

good shootin

Good shooti , very informative , Have you ever put a Tc maxie ball thru yer torture test?
Wayles

 

[Busta]

Sorry guys, but I just got off the phone with Ben, he will not be making any more Huntsman/Sidekick plugs. They are just to cost prohibitive to make by hand, and the tolerances from one NEF breech to the next are just too great. The way he makes these plugs, they come all the way back to the breech end of the barrel and fit flush.

A lot of work goes into making up one of these plugs. I just couldn't understand how he could do it without having to charge an arm and a leg. I'm sorry I got everybody excited, I really thought we were on to something here. :-[

Back to the drawing board! :'(

We need to find someone with a CNC that could make one just like the T/C plug.

 

[Underclocked]

I still think that machinist in Utah (the one Bowers gets the parts from) might do it for us.

 

[wayles]

Plug

Any good machine shop can make it. The more there are the cheaper it gets. Most will not design it they will require a demensioned drawing. It will have to have the tolerences spelled out and the metal specified. It keeps the liability off of them.Thats mostly why they hesitate people come in and say make me one of these , and it kinda has to be like this ect., scares em off. Programming takes longer than doing the job so if some of you can get together it will sure make it cheaper.
Wayles