Knight KRB7 powder questions

[Anonymous]

I ordered my Montana X-Treme Bore Conditioner from Grafs. 6oz will last a long time as you only put a small amount on a patch and run it down and out.

I have used Shooters Ridge cleaner with BH209. It cleans the bore very well.

Both of you did an excellent job on getting your guns blowback free. Should make for easier cleaning and better shooting.

 

[Hornet22savage]

It sure is a beautiful thing, plus for the ones reading this thread from the beginning I have to eat my words. I once stated earlier that the KRB was a dirty gun and that was the way it would be. Well I was wrong so serve those words to me on a gold platter and somther them in hot sauce. :lol:

 

[ShawnT]

Well I was wrong so serve those words to me on a gold platter and somther them in hot sauce.

I think I can just picture you Dancing on the range today! :lol: :lol: :lol:

Believe it or not I have my eye on another KRB. 8)

 

[Hornet22savage]

I truly was tickled, the only thing I can't shoot are Powerbelts. They are too loose in my barrel and the primer unseats them before the powder ignites. They shoot fine with loose T7 though. All I need now is to get a good scope and start some serious load development.

 

[jsteurrys]

I truly was tickled, the only thing I can't shoot are Powerbelts.

That is no big deal as there are better bullets out there IMO that are much cheaper.

 

[jsteurrys]

ShawnT,

My 12 year old bottle of Knight Oil that came with my first Knight DISC, which I have never used, says right on the front label that it contains Teflon. The oil has seperated out from sitting on the shelf for so long. There is a layer of white colored material at the bottom of the container now.

I degrease my bores with brake cleaner prior to shooting.

You are almost there now once you get the crud ring figured out.

 

[ShawnT]

jstuerrys,

I used to have the same bottle. Actually I have used a couple of them. After you guys mentioned the teflon last yesterday I got to thinking about it and remembered that little sign on the old label. It is not on the new bottle I got about a month ago.

 

[GM54-120]

BTW PTFE is Teflon or a variant. Brake cleaner seemed to be the best if you are in a pinch. use with caution though. It is not friendly to stock finishes and some plastics.

 

[jsteurrys]

Brake cleaner seemed to be the best if you are in a pinch. use with caution though. It is not friendly to stock finishes and some plastics.

Very good advice.

 

[Busta]

ShawnT & Hornet22Savage,

Looks like you guys are getting it figured out, just wonder where the OP went? I think he could benefit from this post.

As far as the crud ring, I would also have to say that it is either something you are using, OR that portion of your bore has been etched by the Triple Se7en crud ring in the past.

 

[ShawnT]

Busta,

I was wondering about him too. I guess he gave up or thought we hijacked his thread. We are working on the same thing he was asking about though.

I am hoping that the knight oil or the knight cleaner is the problem. The only thing I am unsure of is the Knight oil. I seem to remember the original stuff that had teflon, and that was confirmed by jstuerrys, was a more clear/light colored oil. This new Knight oil looks more brown like Birchwood Casy Sheath, and is thinner. I don't think this rifle was shot enough to have etched the bore but maybe. I really can't see it when I look in there after cleaning, looks brite and shiny. I have used the Knight cleaner when I was done shooting for the day though and I am pretty sure it does have teflon in it, I have had it for a long time. You would have thought that after shooting a couple of rounds and cleaning with alcohol that any residual teflon would be gone. After swabing and verifying it was gone with the plug out I did not relube, just loaded and shot. Still got the crud ring. I am not sure if the FP10 will cause the same problem or not. I am trying to locate some of the Montana Xtreme Bore conditioner, but so far Grafs, MidSouth and Midway are out. I plan to clean the bore with some Butches Bore shine and JB, then Flush it with Carb&Choke cleaner. I can then apply some of the Montana after that. We'll see.

 

[ShawnT]

I goofed. Graf & Sons did have the oil. It was some bullets I wanted they did not have. So I have some Montana Bore conditioner coming now. I will wait till I get it to do a thorough scrubbing.

 

[ShawnT]

I finally got the chance to shoot the KRB again today. I scrubbed the bore out with Butches Boreshine and then JBed the bore. I then cleaned it all out and used break cleaner to rinse out the bore. Finally I applaied a patch of Montana Bore Conditioner. Today I started out by flushing out the bore with the Break Cleaner, then used a patch that I sprayed the break cleaner on to swab the bore. I then popped of 2 rem STS primers and used the wet patch to swab it out again and one dry patch to follow. I loaded 100 grains of BH with a 300gn Deep Curl in a Harvester Short Black Sabot. I shot this load 3 times with a Rem STS primer. I also swabed between shots with a lightly dampened (alcohol) patch to check for the crud ring. I felt anly a slight amount of crud in the same area as before. After the 3 shots I removed the Breech Plug to check the bore. I pushed one wet patch down and saw only a small amount of crud about 1 inch in front of where the end of the breech plug would be. I used one wet patch (butches) to clean the bore outand dried it with another patch THen swabbed with one wet with break cleaner and one dry. I then reinstalled the plug and loaded up with a 250gn Deep Curl and 110 gn BH with the STS primer. After the first shot I swabbed with the light alhohol patch and found I had the same Hard Crud ring I had reported before. :huh?: I pulled the plug and found that the crud was about 1 inch long and about 1 inch in front of where the end of the plug would be. So not I am really scratching my head saying Whut the F just happened! So i had to use several Patches with Butches and a brass brush to remove it. I thin swabbed again with the break cleaner. So I am wondering to myself Why would the lighter bullet and 10 grains more powder cause such a difference in the crud. Then I realized there was one other thing I had changed. On the First load of the day I had wrapped the BP with Pink Teflon tape and one the next I used the thinner white. So what the heck, I wrapped it with the Pink again. Loaded up the same 250Dc and 110gn BH. After the shot I swabbed and found it again had just a light crud ring that was removed with the wet patch and one dry! :shock: So I shot 3 more and it remained the same way each time. I removed the plug and saw that the wet patch removed about 95% of the crud and what was left was only one the bottom of the bore. I reinstalled the BP with the Pink tape and loaded up the 300gn DC with 110gn BH and shot this load for 3 rounds with a STS. Had the same light crud ring as before. I then repeated this same load but used the W209, then the CCI209M. The last shot virtually the same with the same light crud ring. The difference in the crud ring when using the white tape verses the pink was Huge. I don't really see why there would be a difference in it other than the seal, but both sealed the plug without letting it blow back into the threads. :huh?: Here is a pic of the target. I only shot at 50 today with a front bag rest, I did not feel like wading through the snow all the way to the 100 yard line, and I was primarily looking to see if changing to the MX bore conditioner + eliminating the Knight cleaner made a difference. The first load is the lower right 3 shot group. I never readjusted the scope from the old 777 load from hunting season. The next 4 from the 250 Dc is the next target up middle right. The First shot with the white tape on the plug was the shot that hit the center. Next 2 cut one hole (pink tape) are lower and I messed up that last one out to the right. The rest are shot in a counter clockwise order. Not really any change when switching just primers.

Here are the primers, still clean and no hand/delay fires. It was 32* and 15 mph gusting wind in my face.

 

[Omega45]

Nice targets, them Deep Curls cut nice holes.

Next trip out try just swabbing the Montana X-treme Bore Conditioner out with a dry patch, pop a few primers to foul the bore, load and shoot. IMO by using brake cleaner you are stripping the Conditioner out of the bore and defeating the purpose of using it in the first place.

 

[jsteurrys]

I need to think about this one for a while. I have never experienced this issue using BH 209.

 

[Omega45]

jsteurrys,

I am scratching my head over a crud ring with BH209 also. I have used BH209 and never had any issues in alot of different brand muzzleloaders.

 

[GM54-120]

Omega45

I only used brake cleaner to remove Teflon and/or petroleum based oils. Using MX i either dry swab and pop a couple of primers or i forget to swab first and do it after shooting the primers. AND only once with a dry patch. IMO you want to leave some of the MX in the bore but only a very light amount. I avoid polishes after using it too.

After fouling the bore i dont swab at all any more when using BH209. It does seem like light loads of BH209 and lighter bullets leave a bit more fouling but its never made it harder to load.

If the condition continues this may be a perfect chance to try the Ultrabore coating from Dynatek? Something is effecting that part of the bore and im out of ideas.

 

[Omega45]

GM54-120,

I was not saying not to use brake cleaner to clean the bore thoroughly. I believe he did all the correct things prior to initially applying MX Bore Conditioner. In his post he advised he swabbed the MX out with brake cleaner prior to shooting.

 

[GM54-120]

Omega45

I know, i was agreeing with you. it should only be used when you want squeaking clean metal. I "think" its best though to leave a small amount of MX conditioner in the bore to get the best results over time. Otherwise you are back to step one all over again.

 

[Hornet22savage]

I have only put 14 shots through my KRB since figuring out the proper conversion like Shwan did, but I have not had any of this crud ring nonsense. The last Crud ring I had was with T7 pellets and that was a terrible one. I have been cleaning out my barrel with the T/C T17 pre-saturated patches and no after treatment or bore protectant.