W209 primer blew up in CVA Accura.

[WDey]

Fairly new to muzzleloaders. Bought the CVA Accura V2 LR 45 cal. last year. Accurate enough to kill a 130" 4 point buck at 180 yds.

This year while sighting in I had a primer blow up. The gun kicked like a mule on that shot. Scope kissed my nose.
Was shooting through a chronograph. The first shot (no problem) was 1226 fps and on target.
Second shot (ouch) was 735 fps plus a sore shoulder and nose and possibly a few expletives...

When I opened the action the primer was flattened and black and looked like shrapnel. Also including a comparison photo with the primer from the previous shot. You can see it shows an indentation from the firing pin retainer.
The load is:
Winchester W209 primer
BH209 60 gr by weight
Powerbelt ELR 280 gr.

I use the CVA BH209 QRBP.

I verified that I didn't double load the gun.
All loads had been weighed that morning and put into speed loaders.
Bullet was seated on the powder.
I had disassembled and cleaned everything including the firing pin assembly and breech plug only 5 shots before.

What happened?
Is the gun safe to shoot?
Is it a gun or primer problem?
Is this common?

Thanks for your help.

 

[HC]

Breech plug vent eroded too much?

 

[deermanok]

Maybe the breech plug was clogged up?

 

[52Bore]

Be sure your loading rod fits the ojive of the bullet.. you may have pulled it off the powder??
If so, I could see a problem and lack of velocity.

 

[Chris W.]

A primer blowing apart like that is typically a sign of excessive pressure. How many shots had you fired off before the primer blow out? What does the breach plug flash hole look like?

 

[HC]

Be sure your loading rod fits the ojive of the bullet.. you may have pulled it off the powder??
If so, I could see a problem and lack of velocity.

. I’m thinking what 52 Bore said is likely what happened. The power belt moved off the powder.

 

[Travis299]

I believe that the damaged primer shows that the fired powder charge exited back through the fire/flame hole, .030" as the primer itself does not have that amount of charge to cause that damage. JMHO

 

[michiganmuzzy]

I agree with HC and 52bore about the bullet very likely being off the powder. I would try to check that barrel for a ring(bulge or loose spot)

 

[ENCORE50A]

A primer blowing apart like that is typically a sign of excessive pressure....

I agree. There's no doubt that that was a pressure issue, regardless the cause. Could have been the bullet moved, or could have been a double charge, double bullet or any other combination. Over pressure caused that.

 

[leftyml]

I agree with chris w and encore50a

 

[sdporter]

Only over-pressure caused that. I would definitely check your breech plug. My bet is it has one hell of a hole in it.

 

[WDey]

A primer blowing apart like that is typically a sign of excessive pressure. How many shots had you fired off before the primer blow out? What does the breach plug flash hole look like?

Had fired one shot before that on that day. Fired 5 shots the week before. Prior to that I had taken everything apart and cleaned including the breech plug and firing pin assembly.

The flash hole looks the same as it did beforehand. I see no damage to the breech plug, barrel or anything else.

 

[WDey]

I agree with HC and 52bore about the bullet very likely being off the powder. I would try to check that barrel for a ring(bulge or loose spot)

I wondered about that too. No obvious changes to the barrel. I've cleaned it since and looking down the inside it still looks perfect.

 

[WDey]

I agree. There's no doubt that that was a pressure issue, regardless the cause. Could have been the bullet moved, or could have been a double charge, double bullet or any other combination. Over pressure caused that.

Possible the bullet could have moved, but doesn't seem likely. I use a loading tip specifically for the Powerbelt ELR bullets. Not sure how it could hook the bullet and pull it off the powder. The bullet sits in the barrel tight enough that I can't imagine it slipping off the powder itself.

I'm confident it wasn't a double charge or double bullet. I wondered if that was the case too. I had measured out each charge that morning and put them into speed loaders with a bullet in each. I only took 2 shots and when I got home I checked. Only 2 speed loaders were empty.

 

[WDey]

I sincerely appreciate the feedback I'm getting here. I had thought about most of the items mentioned here as well and have been able to mark most of them off as not being the problem. One that I can't be absolutely sure about is whether the bullet came off the powder.
No one has suggested that the primer might be the problem, so it seems that is not a typical issue.
Please keep other ideas coming. I'm also working with CVA to see if they've got other ideas.
Thanks for your help!

 

[WDey]

Only over-pressure caused that. I would definitely check your breech plug. My bet is it has one hell of a hole in it.

I expected that too, but the breech plug looks good. The hole seems to be the same size as before the shot. No damage to it, the firing pin assembly or the barrel that I can see.

 

[billyboy*]

Have you tried pushing a Bore Size or Saboted bullet down without powder to feel for a Loose Spot at the Breech?

 

[ENCORE50A]

..................................Fairly new to muzzleloaders.

................................. I had a primer blow up. The gun kicked like a mule on that shot. Scope kissed my nose.

These two things provide some evidence.
Now at one point we all were new to muzzleloaders. Some of us learned on our own, some of us were helped by other knowledgeable muzzleloader shooters.
If you shoot muzzleloaders long enough, and no matter how long you've been shooting them, things can and will go wrong. Its not a matter of "IF", but "WHEN".

MUZZLELOADER 101..... WITNESS MARK

First and most important question/s......... DO YOU HAVE AND USE A WITNESS MARK? I MEAN USE THAT MARK EVERY TIME WITHOUT FAIL???????

Second question/s.................. Do you keep track and in order your charge tubes and spent charge tubes?

Possible the bullet could have moved, but doesn't seem likely. I use a loading tip specifically for the Powerbelt ELR bullets. Not sure how it could hook the bullet and pull it off the powder. The bullet sits in the barrel tight enough that I can't imagine it slipping off the powder itself.

I'm confident it wasn't a double charge or double bullet. I wondered if that was the case too. I had measured out each charge that morning and put them into speed loaders with a bullet in each. I only took 2 shots and when I got home I checked. Only 2 speed loaders were empty.

Note: I'm writing while you're posting..... LOL

I along with every other muzzleloader, at least seasoned muzzleloader, will tell you that "doesn't seem likely" could very well be another mistake.
Example: I've shot and hunted with muzzleloaders since 1973 and up until I think it was 1917, I never had an issue but, one day I had my very first dry ball. Second example: Just 2 yrs ago, I double loaded a bullet. FIRST TIME! Guess how I knew............ my witness mark.

You may have only fired two rounds but, with the "kicked like a mule" and nose kick, my suspicion is that you double loaded a bullet. Could very well be wrong but, evidence sure points to it. Be careful. Get a routine and never waver from it. If you don't have a witness mark on your ramrod.... DO IT.

Without quoting billyboys last post, follow his instructions.

 

[michiganmuzzy]

You wont be able to see a 'ring' or loose spot in the barrel by looking down the bore. Loading a bullet or saboted bullet might let you feel a looser spot.

 

[Lee 9]

Short started is a definite possibility