Help w/ Adding Scope to Percussion GPH

[morehops]

I tried the other forum and it was suggested I might try here. I have a .54 Lyman GPH that shoots better than my old eyes can resolve in fading light. I know from using binocs that adding a scope would give me 10 more minutes of shooting time and enable me to discern a fine target another 20 yards in the field instead of my peep sights. I know this is going to be extremely non-traditional but I don't care for the new fangled thingys much and I have several other percussion rifles. My eyes are taking precedent here. My problem is finding a way to get scope bases on the barrel. Gun smiths were hinky about drilling the barrel. Pearson has a dove tail mount but he doubted that his rig would take my .54 except with a scope limited to 5 oz. Based on other suggestions the only viable ones I have now are :
1. Get a piece of flat stock and have angles ground into the edges. The forward end would be screwed onto or welded to a dove tail. The rear would have a hole drilled where it would attach via the tang screw. The one problem could be that the distance between anchor points would be longer than 9 in. The other is whether the dove tail would hold up to continued pounding.
2. Use a Permatex product and "glue" the bases on. I also considered JB Weld. This is my #1 solution right now due to its simplicity. I don't care if it devalues the rifle.
If anyone else has had experience or luck solving my problem, I'd love to hear it.

 

[michiganmuzzy]

I think having bases silver soldered on would be far better than gluing or JBWelding. But there ought to be plenty of metal for a good gunsmith to drill and tap for mount screw holes.
BTW im trying to find the right mount to use a scope on a TC Renegade. Not because of eyesight but to take advantage of its full potential

 

[deermanok]

You'll have to consider where to mount a scope on a side hammer gun. That pesky hammer can get in the way of the scope bell.
As MM said, there's plenty of meat on the barrel to have a good smith drill and tap it for a scope base.
I'm not sure that gluing a base on the barrel will hold up for very long.

 

[gregdaws]

I have a Lyman Custom Carbine that is drilled for mounts. The only drawback that I have encountered is that if you ever want to bore the barrel out screw hole depth can be an issue.

 

[morehops]

All good suggestions above. I agree that a drill and tap originally sounded like the standard procedure. I was taken back when the smith looked at it he didn't think it was safe. Ok, that's not my realm so I accepted his opinion. I guess I need to try at least one more smith elsewhere.
I've taken the hammer clearance problem into consideration and I can't imagine a situatiion that would have me boring out my .54.

 

[gregdaws]

All good suggestions above. I agree that a drill and tap originally sounded like the standard procedure. I was taken back when the smith looked at it he didn't think it was safe. Ok, that's not my realm so I accepted his opinion. I guess I need to try at least one more smith elsewhere.
I've taken the hammer clearance problem into consideration and I can't imagine a situatiion that would have me boring out my .54.

The bore on my Lyman was allowed to badly rust by a previous owner. One of the options would have been to have it bored out and re rifled if it hadn’t been for the holes drilled to mount a scope.

The gun cost less than $100 so I can’t complain I just have to pay out for a new barrel.

 

[MTY]

It only takes three threads for a screw to have full holding strength. On a 6X48 base screw that is a pretty short distance. A Marlin 336 base is flat. They use 8X40 threads, and again a three thread depth is not much at that pitch.

If it were me, I would use a flad bottom two flute end mill to make the hole, use a Marlin 336 base and blue locktite. You can glue the base to the barrel to locate the holes, drill, tap, mount the scope and call it a day.

Since the barrel is flat, you can C clamp it place for each hole. Locate, clamp, drill, tap with the tap in the chuck, and move to the next hole. If it were me, I would probably drill a trial hole in a piece of stock to determine how far I needed to drill in order to get three threads. I would set a depth stop at that depth.

I would also drill a hole in a piece of flat stock, tap it, run the screws I was mounting the base with into the hole and grind them to the correct length.
Do not use a hand drill.

 

[michiganmuzzy]

All good suggestions above. I agree that a drill and tap originally sounded like the standard procedure. I was taken back when the smith looked at it he didn't think it was safe. Ok, that's not my realm so I accepted his opinion. I guess I need to try at least one more smith elsewhere.
I've taken the hammer clearance problem into consideration and I can't imagine a situatiion that would have me boring out my .54.

Ask if the GS has experience with MLs. Some have never worked on them and dont know what they can do that would never fly on a CF gun.

 

[MTY]

Actually, he would probably be better off asking a machinist. Go buy a base, walk into a machine shop with the stripped gun and say, "Can you attach this right here?" while pointing to the desired location for the base on the rifle.

 

[fishdfly]

Morehops,

Find a decent gunsmith.

Consider a long eye relief scope, that will keep it away from the hammer, though you may get some dirt on the eye of the scope.

I use to shoot TC Contenders with scopes and the below will keep a base on the rifle, even with short screws.

To keep the base on, I would put a piece of masking tape over the screw holes and attach the base and trace around the base.

Take the base off and cut out the outline of the base. Rough up the area inside the making tape with a file. Flip the base over and rough up the bottom of the base. Put the base back on the rifle and put one screw in and tighten it down, it the base wiggles, take a bit off the screw to shorten it. Put the screw back and repeat until the each screw is tight. Put some slow epoxy on the base of the rifle and a drop of Lock Tight on each screw and attach the base to the rifle. It is not going to come off.

 

[morehops]

Morehops,

Find a decent gunsmith.

Consider a long eye relief scope, that will keep it away from the hammer, though you may get some dirt on the eye of the scope.

I use to shoot TC Contenders with scopes and the below will keep a base on the rifle, even with short screws.

To keep the base on, I would put a piece of masking tape over the screw holes and attach the base and trace around the base.

Take the base off and cut out the outline of the base. Rough up the area inside the making tape with a file. Flip the base over and rough up the bottom of the base. Put the base back on the rifle and put one screw in and tighten it down, it the base wiggles, take a bit off the screw to shorten it. Put the screw back and repeat until the each screw is tight. Put some slow epoxy on the base of the rifle and a drop of Lock Tight on each screw and attach the base to the rifle. It is not going to come off.

I think you may be right about a smith working on an unknown-to -him type gun. It seemed to me that rifles have been getting tapped for many a year and that this shouldn't be a big problem . You gentlemen have given me the advice I was looking for. I will look for a gunsmith that is interested in your suggestions and I thank you.

 

[fishdfly]

You might post the part of the country you live in, maybe some one can recommend a smith.

Good luck.

 

[Benchman]

I tried the other forum and it was suggested I might try here. I have a .54 Lyman GPH that shoots better than my old eyes can resolve in fading light. I know from using binocs that adding a scope would give me 10 more minutes of shooting time and enable me to discern a fine target another 20 yards in the field instead of my peep sights. I know this is going to be extremely non-traditional but I don't care for the new fangled thingys much and I have several other percussion rifles. My eyes are taking precedent here. My problem is finding a way to get scope bases on the barrel. Gun smiths were hinky about drilling the barrel. Pearson has a dove tail mount but he doubted that his rig would take my .54 except with a scope limited to 5 oz. Based on other suggestions the only viable ones I have now are :
1. Get a piece of flat stock and have angles ground into the edges. The forward end would be screwed onto or welded to a dove tail. The rear would have a hole drilled where it would attach via the tang screw. The one problem could be that the distance between anchor points would be longer than 9 in. The other is whether the dove tail would hold up to continued pounding.
2. Use a Permatex product and "glue" the bases on. I also considered JB Weld. This is my #1 solution right now due to its simplicity. I don't care if it devalues the rifle.
If anyone else has had experience or luck solving my problem, I'd love to hear it.

Offset rings and a standard weaver base. 1

 

[Benchman]

https://www.tuffzone.com/weaver-side-offset-ring-rws

 

[deermanok]

I have a Traditions deerhunter rifle that is factory drilled and tapped for a scope.

 

[vintovka]

Some thoughts from an age retired smith here. Drilling and tapping a ML can be a daunting challenge. I have seen barrels totally ruined by drilling into the bore or adding a too deep second dovetail near breech, The simple presence of mount holes on many MLs adds immediate doubt and seems to significantly lower resale value even if factory. Since many custom rifles have soft soldered under ribs i have wondered about doing same for a scope base. Heat and proximity to breech does comes to mind. Lastly the availability and cost of replacement barrels in now sky high. Saw a .50 TCH barrel go for near $500 with many bids.

 

[michiganmuzzy]

https://www.tuffzone.com/weaver-side-offset-ring-rws

That would look awful on my renegade, imho, but i really like that. I wonder about eye alignment on a side lock. Looks like it was designed for an AR platform. The price is pretty inexpensive, i may just buy a couple to see how they work out.

 

[Benchman]

I have a couple of sets of Traditions performance offset scope mounts that are essentially the same thing. Seems to work pretty well.

 

[Benchman]

 

[vintovka]

View attachment 18357

Nice but What mount and how is it stalled? Off set hammer?