large rifle primers in a 209 skirt ?

[GM54-120]

Never measured it but the plug is REALLY short. Woodman's plug is also super short in their Patriot rifle. Its easy to follow the bouncing ball. Just compare how it progresses from 209 to LRMP to DI. Each shows a gain in FPS as the flame path gets shorter. Then compare a 209 plug and LRMP plug with similar flame path lengths....FPS is so close it dont matter. You only get part of the benefits of a LRMP unless you change the plug geometry.

You can buy the Woodsman Patriot plug. Not sure if Melvin would sell his or not. Probably if he still has some laying around.

 

[mwwoodman]

These are machined brass 209 skirt's/bodies. Rim thickness is easily held within .0003" for repeatable sealing. Can be reused but are inexpensive enough to toss after one use.

 

[ronlaughlin]

These modules are the same size as a 209 primer? What do they cost?


These modules are designed to seal on the rim, not the end?

 

[Sideshow]

These are machined brass 209 skirt's/bodies. Rim thickness is easily held within .0003" for repeatable sealing. Can be reused but are inexpensive enough to toss after one use.

Hold the show !!!!! We NEED MORE INFO !!!!!!! Where , who , what and etc !!!!

 

[Leigh Clambakes]

I agree.
Tell us more.

 

[Sideshow]

Never measured it but the plug is REALLY short. Woodman's plug is also super short in their Patriot rifle. Its easy to follow the bouncing ball. Just compare how it progresses from 209 to LRMP to DI. Each shows a gain in FPS as the flame path gets shorter. Then compare a 209 plug and LRMP plug with similar flame path lengths....FPS is so close it dont matter. You only get part of the benefits of a LRMP unless you change the plug geometry.

You can buy the Woodsman Patriot plug. Not sure if Melvin would sell his or not. Probably if he still has some laying around.

Never measured it but the plug is REALLY short. Woodman's plug is also super short in their Patriot rifle. Its easy to follow the bouncing ball. Just compare how it progresses from 209 to LRMP to DI. Each shows a gain in FPS as the flame path gets shorter. Then compare a 209 plug and LRMP plug with similar flame path lengths....FPS is so close it dont matter. You only get part of the benefits of a LRMP unless you change the plug geometry.

You can buy the Woodsman Patriot plug. Not sure if Melvin would sell his or not. Probably if he still has some laying around.

Woodsman plug is similar/same as Melvins ??? Even a DI isnt that tough to " kinda adapt ".....huummm....thanks GM54--120 ....... Time to sharpen the pencil......ya think that 700's screw could handle Melvin ???

 

[Sideshow]

Never measured it but the plug is REALLY short. Woodman's plug is also super short in their Patriot rifle. Its easy to follow the bouncing ball. Just compare how it progresses from 209 to LRMP to DI. Each shows a gain in FPS as the flame path gets shorter. Then compare a 209 plug and LRMP plug with similar flame path lengths....FPS is so close it dont matter. You only get part of the benefits of a LRMP unless you change the plug geometry.

You can buy the Woodsman Patriot plug. Not sure if Melvin would sell his or not. Probably if he still has some laying around.

I recently had to put a ventliner in the White super 91 , a factory savage liner . While there i made a small change to its flash chamber as well(plugs) . The result is a 99% clean breech after 4 shots of T7 3f @ 90gr in my .410 . I know thats not many shots but the #11 caps arent destroyed either !!! In fact theyve Barely Swelled !!!

Out of a .410 this is "Quite a Bit Hotter" than the same charge in a 45 or 50 with "much more pressure" for these results to be overlooked .

Think im on to something......

Ignition speed is also MUCH quicker , not that it ever was slow for a #11 with maybe a 1/2" of channel.....nipple included , thats built in.....

 

[michiganmuzzy]

I recently had to put a ventliner in the White super 91 , a factory savage liner . While there i made a small change to its flash chamber as well(plugs) . The result is a 99% clean breech after 4 shots of T7 3f @ 90gr in my .410 . I know thats not many shots but the #11 caps arent destroyed either !!! Think im on to something......
Ignition speed is also MUCH quicker , not that it ever was slow......

Me too on the ventliner. While waiting for my bestill plug i drilled and tapped my one white plug for a ventliner. Havent used it tho cuz the new one showed up.

 

[GM54-120]

Woodsman plug is similar/same as Melvins ??? Even a DI isnt that tough to " kinda adapt ".....huummm....thanks GM54--120 ....... Time to sharpen the pencil......ya think that 700's screw could handle Melvin ???

Sounds even smaller to me. Almost 1" long for the 50cal plug and the primer is just barely off the powder. Actually sounds too short in my book. It has virtually no flash channel at 1/8" long
https://woodmanarms.com/breech-plugs/

$30 to find out but you will need the little wrench adapter too.
https://store.bigwoodsbucks.com/accessories?pagenumber=3

EDIT:
In a older post he said the new plugs use a 12mm socket. If you want to tinker it might be worth asking first.

 

[mwwoodman]

Sounds even smaller to me. Almost 1" long for the 50cal plug and the primer is just barely off the powder. Actually sounds too short in my book. It has virtually no flash channel at 1/8" long
https://woodmanarms.com/breech-plugs/

$30 to find out but you will need the little wrench adapter too.
https://store.bigwoodsbucks.com/accessories?pagenumber=3

EDIT:
In a older post he said the new plugs use a 12mm socket. If you want to tinker it might be worth asking first.

I don't use these brass 209 modules in the Patriot plugs. They are more specifically intended for a bolt action that is in the works. I do have a different Patriot 209 plug for smokeless powder or massive BH209 loads, which just drops in. It's certainly longer and much different in design. When I designed all this stuff, it was for the Northeast tracker. These are hunters who chase deer in the big woods by following them in the snow. You won't put a gun in your hand that carries this good, a highly desired feature for hiking 10 miles. Around here, 200 yards is almost impossible. 100 yards, sometimes. Certainly it's not a one size fits all. The same goes for the breech plug. Most of the 200 .45 cal Patriots I sold in the last 12 months are shooting 225 Fury star tips, in a Harvester CRS. They shoot sub moa groups. Never once has the breech plug hole become clogged. They use BH209 and go all season without cleaning the barrel. These loads have zero issues with the short breech plug. I guess I have no desire to change something that brings a line to my door to buy these, all by word of mouth. I am however designing some new rifles that are geared for longer range Midwest shooting. It will use either 209's or the brass rifle primer modules that I posted, in a "hybrid" plug which has a rim seal.
I'm still a fan of as short as possible flash channel. Look at a rifle cartridge, pretty wide open. A well designed action, made to handle and support the primer will work great. The faster you ignite the powder, the better accuracy and quicker lock time you get.

I did switch the Patriot .45 plug to a hex but the store is not updated yet, I'm burning up old inventory. This plug is of no use to anyone unless they have the .45 Patriot.

 

[mwwoodman]

These modules are the same size as a 209 primer? What do they cost?


These modules are designed to seal on the rim, not the end?

Yes, rim seal and same outside dims as a 209 but consistent. I hold tight tolerance on the rim to allow for consistent head space sealing. I'm estimating they are going to be about 20 cents. Any day now a new machine is rolling where I can make these in 3-4 seconds each, 24/7 lights out. If you wanted a few, I have some here now, send me a message.

 

[GM54-120]

Are SRP or LRP used in them but the larger question would be.....What shell holder is used to primer them?

 

[Leigh Clambakes]

Pm sent.

 

[Patrick McChristy]

If I can get some I plan on grabbing a case and opening up the primer pocket a little

 

[ronlaughlin]

Yes, rim seal and same outside dims as a 209 but consistent. I hold tight tolerance on the rim to allow for consistent head space sealing. I'm estimating they are going to be about 20 cents. Any day now a new machine is rolling where I can make these in 3-4 seconds each, 24/7 lights out. If you wanted a few, I have some here now, send me a message.

What is the actual over all length? Reason for asking is 209 primers vary from 0.294" to 0.304"

 

[mwwoodman]

What is the actual over all length? Reason for asking is 209 primers vary from 0.294" to 0.304"

.3000 +/- .0005"

 

[mwwoodman]

Are SRP or LRP used in them but the larger question would be.....What shell holder is used to primer them?

LRP
I've just been using a small arbor press to install primers. I might know a guy that can design and manufacture installation/removal tools.

 

[45-70]

The plug will also make a difference

 

[Sideshow]

LRP
I've just been using a small arbor press to install primers. I might know a guy that can design and manufacture installation/removal tools.

A shell holder for them would also be really nice !!! Id prefer to use my rcbs hand primer and/or my rock chucker reloading press . Even a lee hand press too for range or field use .

If you put this much effort into this phase of your rifle development this is going to be 1 heck of a rifle !!!! It certainly has my attention as NO ONE ELSE has done this concerning our opinion or input to my knowledge !!!! I hope its a historicaly changeing release of your new baby !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! --- Sideshow

 

[marlinmonty]

Fantastic lesson going on here , thank you fellas for sharing this information with us all .